NYT Magazine Poetry Editor resigns; Editor of JewishFiction.net interviewed; lit mags make $$ hundreds of thousands in sub fees; Blacklist Lit; profile of Southwest Review; markets; jobs; and more
I profoundly respect every person’s right to make their own choices according to their own values. In that vein I’d like to include my non-Zionist Jewish view that genocide committed ostensibly in my name is abhorrent to me. I have felt prejudice in Jewish writing spaces because of my views. Why do I leave a comment? I think it’s important to demonstrate that there is more than one Jewish perspective in this international conversation. (On a lighter note, the old joke is “two Jews, three opinions,” and I’d like to represent that here.)
Hope to switch out another subscription to become a paid subscriber here in the new year, Becky. In the past few years the topics we've addressed from time to time seem collect into a pretty discouraging outlook sometimes—age bias, increasing lit mags with bios that reflect higher-prestige poets (whatever that means—books out, awards, won, Pushcart noms, etc—and then finally, recently, the issue of names....and these days, all of what many things that means. Still, I persist. Why? These topics are so important to discuss in a safe place—which is what you provide. And also because whatever the obstacles that seem to be increasing, I take great joy in creating and revising my work, knowing that it's deeper and better as I go, and sending it out into the world whether it finds a home there, or not. An early mentor of mine who told me long ago that I needed to send my work out, instead of keeping it private, spoke these words: "Once you have finished a poem, it does not belong to you anymore." That, and the resilience I developed intentionally, keeps me subbing. And I am tremendously grateful to have this space, and look forward to 2024, when I will receive "the full experience."
Re: "Antisemitism:" The plot thickens when we are asking what antisemitism? What is antisemitism?There are two sets of Semites in Israel, the Jews and the Palestinians. Yes, both are Semites. Recently 3 Palestinian students were attacked and killed in the US. Was this a hate crime? the newspaper asks. Yes, this was an antisemitic hate crime. There is also the confusion of "standing with Israel." Netanyahu was only elected to office by a coalition with right-wing extremists. Like Trump, he will face court for many crimes and corruption when he leaves office. He is dishonest, greedy, corrupt, and ruthless. He is in the process of a, destroying democracy in Israel, and b, committing genocide of the Palestinian people. To oppose such policies and such a leader is not antisemitism, nor being "against Israel." I worry about my cousins in Israel, but my heart breaks with sorrow and shame for the suffering of the Palestinians.
As to anti-Semitism, it only refers to hatred of Jews; it was specifically created (as a word) by the Germans to describe Jew hatred. Yes, there was a horrific recent hate crime against the Palestinian students (and against other Palestinians in the US and Canada after October 7), but that isn't anti-Semitism (although I repeat, it is still a hate crime, and anti-Islamic).
I agree with you about everything else (i.e., that anti-Semitism doesn't include criticism of Israel, Netanyahu is a horrible right wing leader, the wholesale bombing of Gaza is horrible . ..)
I do not take my definitions from Nazis dating from 1930-something. The word must be updated, according to common sense.
It is essential to connect these two very closely related groups of human beings, rather than insist on outdated terminology that apparently makes an artificial distinction between them, and gives Jews primacy as Semites.
If you make antisemitism mean something else, you’ll need to substitute a word for hatred of the Jews in particular. It has its own history, and a very particular one, not shared by other groups.
I’m not spoiling for a fight, but that’s undeniable, in history if not in etymology.
Good point, the word genocide is thrown around regularly linked with Israel, but if you look up the actual definition, what is going on is far from genocide, especially if one is familiar with all the things Israel does to prevent civilian casualties. Of course that doesn't make the deaths any less horrible, and Israel isn't perfect, especially after a massacre. But words do matter and my guess is that genocide (which only one actor in the conflict is committing --Hamas charter of 1988, never rescinded) is being used to minimize the Holocaust
Really interesting... Submittable has changed a lot in the past few years, focusing on large enterprise clients, and raising their rates substantially, so I imagine he had a lot to do with that. Also, when literary magazines use Submittable for submissions, they pay twice: their annual subscription for the privilege of using the platform, and then .99 + 5% of any fee they collect.
I wonder who owns this group of literary magazines now. A 500K mailing list is very impressive.
(Side note, every time I try to type "litmag" my computer tries to autocorrect to "litmus." I think there is a metaphor in there somewhere.)
The literary world is just a reflection in miniature of the rest of the world. Every Jewish writer and I'm sure every Palestinian one is hurting right now. We have every kind of feeling about these events, sometimes holding contradictory views at the same time. The rest of you need to be kind, keeping this in mind. Hate is never the right way to go, despite anger, hurt, and horror.
See Sky Island Journal's submission page https://www.skyislandjournal.com/submissions for its statement of support for all writers in Palestine/Israel during the war. As they say, please spread the word.
Becky! How did you know personal training is my day job! (How unliterary) You got all the terms and trends! Here I am sitting on the stairs convincing myself a day off will do me good to justify reading your great LM News! A wealth of wonderful info!
I dunno, if everything is sourced from the fellow’s bio, it sure seems he, at least, is being as transparent as can be expected. I don’t know what I expect in terms of financial transparency from private ventures in the literary scene. I see some of the dangers, and object strongly to some practices, but we’re not on their board or anything.
When I interrupt people who are arguing about which side to take and mention what the root cause of it is I get crickets. So I let it go.
But I guess I missed the boat when we were doing Thrice Fiction. Hell, I could have been rolling in moolah instead of letting everybody submit their stuff for nothing. What was I thinking? But yeah - that sounds shady. And we dropped Submittable because it asked for more than we ever made. I don't mind a service sustaining itself by its design, but this info above seems a little... peculiar.
On his website he boasts attracting tens of thousands of subscribers annually, to several online magazines, and not having subscriptions amounting to tens of thousands of dollars. I wonder if there is a way to check the company's financials.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS BECKY. YOUVE DONE A GREAT SERVICE. AS WE SAY IN BROOKLYN, THE LOWER EAST SIDE, KIEV, AND MANY PLACES, "YOU'RE A MENSCH!"
I AM JEWISH, HAVE MANY RELATIVES SLAUGHTERED IN THE HOLOCAUST AND MANY. STORLES AS WELL OF MY FIRST HAND EXPERIENCES WITH ANTI SEMITISM, AND AS I GREW OLDER AND HAVE ARAB FRIENDS-PALESTINIANS, TURKISH KURDS,AND OTHERS I HAVE LEARNED ABOUT THIS COUNTRY'S HATREDS TOWARDS THE ARAB WORLD, NOT TO MENTION THE UNITED STATES' INCESSANT AND OFTEN LETHAL HATRED OF ASIANS AS SO BRILLIANTLY EXPLORED IN TRUONG TRAN'S MONUMENTAL POETRY BOOK LAST YEAR: THE BOOK OF THE OTHER. TWO VERY POWERFUL BOOKS TO BETTER UNDERSTAND PALESTINE ARE MICHAEL PALUMBO'S THE PALESTINIIAN CATASTROPHE, AND THE THOROUGH ANTHOLOGY- MODERN PALESTINIAN LITERATURE BY SALMA JAYYUSI, OVER FIVE HUNDRED PAGES OF FICTION,,POETRY, DRAMA, AND BIOGRAPHY. YOU COULD ADD A BOOK OFSTORIES BY
GHASSAN KANAFANI- PALESTINE'S CHILDREN, AND THE TRANSCENDENT POETRY OF MAHMOUD DARWISH ONE OF THE TOWERING POETS OF THE 20 AND 21 CENTURY IN SUCH BOOKS AS THE BUTTERFLY'S BURDEN,
TWO EXTREMELY VITAL AND IMPORTANT BOOKS ABOUT ANTISEMITISM WOULD BE MY BROTHERS BLOOD (ALSO TITLED AS AND THANE ROSENBAUM'S SHORT STORY COLLECTION ELIJAH VISIBLE. I HAVE A LONGER LIST FOR BOTH AREAS; CONTACT ME AT ERBRILL69@GMAIL.COM). SHALOM.
Sure, particular word: Jew-hatred. Hatred of Jews. There are general words, and particular words. We can generate them as we need them, edit them as we gain a greater understanding of history and dynamics. We are poets, writers. Develop words and meanings is what we do.
I do not appreciate being sent a document of insinuation and mealy-mouthed exhortations to 'reconsider choices' regarding journals and organisations with significantly more intellectual heft and moral authority than the source of the document: the unremarkable 'Practising Writing' blog.
I had enjoyed Lit Mag News for some years, but I'm not willing to put up slime and smear, especially on this issue. Unsubscribing.
Kendall Dunkelberg wrote: "The deal breaker? Finishing Line said they do NOT pay royalties. I should qualify this. They say they won’t pay royalites unless pre-sales reach 500 copies. Only then, would you be considered for a royalty contract. Prior to this, your “payment” is in copies. Prepublication sales are the only factor in this. For the book to go to press, the author must pre-sell at least 75 copies. For 75-104 copies, the press run is 300 copies and the author receives 30 as payment. ...."
Kendall Dunkelberg wrote: "The other thing on the website that could be a tip-off is that there’s NO mention of a book DISTRIBUTOR, and they appear to be primarily focused on selling books online.
Mark Danowsky wrote, quoting from a FLP author agreement: "All FLP books have a preorder sales/prepublication period in which the royalty scale is determined. This is the only way we have successfully been able to publish chapbooks. Your official prepublication/preorder period will last 9 weeks and will be determined by your editor. We determine your royalty payment by the success, or lack thereof, of the advance sales. Below you will find our preorder sales goals." ........
Mark Danowsky wrote, quoting from a FLP author agreement: "Please note: You are never required to buy copies of your book! ...."
Experiences that have been shared with me are in line with Kendall's.
Pre-orders are not optional - - - but mandatory at FLP.
And how well does FLP market the books on their own?
"Marketing" is the dirty word that's never mentioned on these forums, the s.b.d. B.O. of the literary world. But the truly filthy term must be "sales figures" - - - never ever brought up in polite conversation lest it result in a spontaneous attack of diarrhea (I suppose).
Anyway, has anyone dealt with FLP recently? Are they as bad as in Kendall described in 2019? Have they reformed?
Genuinely interested in learning more about FLP from poets who have submitted there. Thanks.
This is not meant to be a comment for Linda but I am adding here since there is discussion about FLP. Please be careful what you write, everyone. There are a lot of us who have been published by FLP and we don't need to be damaged by incorrect info. FLP uses Ingram for distribution. Yes, you have to sell a certain (non-onerous) amount of books to qualify for Ingram. I have liked the pre-order method (for a book or two) because you have immediate readers for reviews, etc. That said, too many preorders might wear out your mailing list! I've been happy with them and love their covers. I have also been published by Kelsay and Alien Buddha Press (good experience with both). Since FLP publishes a lot of poets, without them a lot of books would go unpublished because most other publishers publish very few poetry books.
Thank you, Luanne, for sticking to the topic - experiences with Finishing Line Press.
I hope FLP markets better than Alien Buddha Press. I doubt ABP uses Ingram for distribution. I paid to have an ARC created, which ABP won't do; I also paid to put my book on NetGalley.
I think it's on us these days to do most of our own marketing. ABP has put together a couple of small things, and now Kelsay is hosting readings, which is really nice. They weren't doing that when my book came out. I'd love to see a list of small poetry presses that really help market and publish more than three books a year.
This reminds me of a kids' dance school that requires parents to buy tickets and costumes for the performances, or the way young opera singers are treated by festivals: pay to play. The performances are earnest and can have many layers of artist value, but it's still pay to play. Partly a side product of how arts are devalued in our (US) society and not well-supported by the government.
Women friends of mine used to sing with Freshmen Chorus and one other choral group. They were required to sell 20 tix to each performance or get dumped.
One woman's mother, who owned a fleet of taxicabs, used to buy up her daughter's tix and give them away to her drivers as a perk, then use this expense as a tax deduction.
It's probably no easier to sell 20 tix to Freshmen Chorus than it is to sell your latest book if your circle of friends is very small.
Actually, FLP does pay royalties to our authors. When I first took over the press in 2000, we paid in copies. It was just me operating the press. I didn’t have a staff to help facilitate in these matters. I paid the authors 10% of their limited pressrun: a 250 pressrun would be 25 copies. I made each book by hand. I loved it. As FLP grew, we saw the need to pay in royalty payments instead of copies. We no longer pay in copies nor do we produce limited pressruns. Also, the sales goal was 55 copies. If an author fails to sell 55 copies, we publish the book anyway and offer a smaller royalty rate. If the book has sales close to 55 copies I usually buy the needed copies to make sure the author has a good royalty rate (or back in the day, a good pressrun.) We have rarely cancelled a book. At no time ever have we had a 500 copy sales goal. I published poetry as an act of love. It makes me cry to think people assume I’ve done this as some kind of con. Also, attacking FLP is attacking any poet I have published. I only select the best manuscripts for publication and for people to say we are an MLM devalues the books of the poets we have published. My goal was always to provide a voice for the underrepresented poets of my day: women, LBGTQ+, people of color, among others. As a mixed-race LatinX woman, I know what it’s like to be passed over. I wanted to make sure people like me were represented.
I've published two chapbooks with FLP, and it's been a very positive experience. For the first one, in 2020, I was paid in copies; the presales determined the size of the print run. For the second one, in 2022, the model had changed such that the presales determined the rate of royalties (and yes, I have received royalties). FLP promotes books through social media, and they encourage authors to use their own social media and other means. I don't think this is unusual. They distribute through Ingram, and the books are also available through Amazon as well as on FLP's own website.
Does FLP do any REAL marketing? EX: do they put the book on NetGalley? EX: do they expose the book during the pre-order interval via a book sales funnel? EX: do they advertise?
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
* * * FUNNEL: When my chapbook "Messengers of the Macabre: Hallowe'en Poems" went thru a book sales funnel 3X (pre-release), it sold 150+ copies. Funnel success depends on the strength and size of the author's mailing list.
* * * NetGalley: My current chapbook "Vampire Ventures" is on NetGalley; this does not affect sales per se - - but it builds book buzz via reviews and exposure to the marketplace.
I profoundly respect every person’s right to make their own choices according to their own values. In that vein I’d like to include my non-Zionist Jewish view that genocide committed ostensibly in my name is abhorrent to me. I have felt prejudice in Jewish writing spaces because of my views. Why do I leave a comment? I think it’s important to demonstrate that there is more than one Jewish perspective in this international conversation. (On a lighter note, the old joke is “two Jews, three opinions,” and I’d like to represent that here.)
Yes, in fact there are many views within the Jewish community. And many sadnesses, no clear answers.
Yes. There is certainly more than one Jewish view.
Hope to switch out another subscription to become a paid subscriber here in the new year, Becky. In the past few years the topics we've addressed from time to time seem collect into a pretty discouraging outlook sometimes—age bias, increasing lit mags with bios that reflect higher-prestige poets (whatever that means—books out, awards, won, Pushcart noms, etc—and then finally, recently, the issue of names....and these days, all of what many things that means. Still, I persist. Why? These topics are so important to discuss in a safe place—which is what you provide. And also because whatever the obstacles that seem to be increasing, I take great joy in creating and revising my work, knowing that it's deeper and better as I go, and sending it out into the world whether it finds a home there, or not. An early mentor of mine who told me long ago that I needed to send my work out, instead of keeping it private, spoke these words: "Once you have finished a poem, it does not belong to you anymore." That, and the resilience I developed intentionally, keeps me subbing. And I am tremendously grateful to have this space, and look forward to 2024, when I will receive "the full experience."
Re: "Antisemitism:" The plot thickens when we are asking what antisemitism? What is antisemitism?There are two sets of Semites in Israel, the Jews and the Palestinians. Yes, both are Semites. Recently 3 Palestinian students were attacked and killed in the US. Was this a hate crime? the newspaper asks. Yes, this was an antisemitic hate crime. There is also the confusion of "standing with Israel." Netanyahu was only elected to office by a coalition with right-wing extremists. Like Trump, he will face court for many crimes and corruption when he leaves office. He is dishonest, greedy, corrupt, and ruthless. He is in the process of a, destroying democracy in Israel, and b, committing genocide of the Palestinian people. To oppose such policies and such a leader is not antisemitism, nor being "against Israel." I worry about my cousins in Israel, but my heart breaks with sorrow and shame for the suffering of the Palestinians.
As to anti-Semitism, it only refers to hatred of Jews; it was specifically created (as a word) by the Germans to describe Jew hatred. Yes, there was a horrific recent hate crime against the Palestinian students (and against other Palestinians in the US and Canada after October 7), but that isn't anti-Semitism (although I repeat, it is still a hate crime, and anti-Islamic).
I agree with you about everything else (i.e., that anti-Semitism doesn't include criticism of Israel, Netanyahu is a horrible right wing leader, the wholesale bombing of Gaza is horrible . ..)
Sorry, Palestinians are also Semites.
I do not take my definitions from Nazis dating from 1930-something. The word must be updated, according to common sense.
It is essential to connect these two very closely related groups of human beings, rather than insist on outdated terminology that apparently makes an artificial distinction between them, and gives Jews primacy as Semites.
If you make antisemitism mean something else, you’ll need to substitute a word for hatred of the Jews in particular. It has its own history, and a very particular one, not shared by other groups.
I’m not spoiling for a fight, but that’s undeniable, in history if not in etymology.
Good point, the word genocide is thrown around regularly linked with Israel, but if you look up the actual definition, what is going on is far from genocide, especially if one is familiar with all the things Israel does to prevent civilian casualties. Of course that doesn't make the deaths any less horrible, and Israel isn't perfect, especially after a massacre. But words do matter and my guess is that genocide (which only one actor in the conflict is committing --Hamas charter of 1988, never rescinded) is being used to minimize the Holocaust
Absolutely correct. Thank you.
Really interesting... Submittable has changed a lot in the past few years, focusing on large enterprise clients, and raising their rates substantially, so I imagine he had a lot to do with that. Also, when literary magazines use Submittable for submissions, they pay twice: their annual subscription for the privilege of using the platform, and then .99 + 5% of any fee they collect.
I wonder who owns this group of literary magazines now. A 500K mailing list is very impressive.
(Side note, every time I try to type "litmag" my computer tries to autocorrect to "litmus." I think there is a metaphor in there somewhere.)
The literary world is just a reflection in miniature of the rest of the world. Every Jewish writer and I'm sure every Palestinian one is hurting right now. We have every kind of feeling about these events, sometimes holding contradictory views at the same time. The rest of you need to be kind, keeping this in mind. Hate is never the right way to go, despite anger, hurt, and horror.
See Sky Island Journal's submission page https://www.skyislandjournal.com/submissions for its statement of support for all writers in Palestine/Israel during the war. As they say, please spread the word.
Becky! How did you know personal training is my day job! (How unliterary) You got all the terms and trends! Here I am sitting on the stairs convincing myself a day off will do me good to justify reading your great LM News! A wealth of wonderful info!
Ha. I'm quite into training as well. Though I admit I cheated a bit and used this site for common terms (which I see now is called "The Art of Manliness," which is kind of amusing.) https://www.artofmanliness.com/health-fitness/fitness/the-ultimate-glossary-of-strength-and-conditioning-terms/
I dunno, if everything is sourced from the fellow’s bio, it sure seems he, at least, is being as transparent as can be expected. I don’t know what I expect in terms of financial transparency from private ventures in the literary scene. I see some of the dangers, and object strongly to some practices, but we’re not on their board or anything.
When I interrupt people who are arguing about which side to take and mention what the root cause of it is I get crickets. So I let it go.
But I guess I missed the boat when we were doing Thrice Fiction. Hell, I could have been rolling in moolah instead of letting everybody submit their stuff for nothing. What was I thinking? But yeah - that sounds shady. And we dropped Submittable because it asked for more than we ever made. I don't mind a service sustaining itself by its design, but this info above seems a little... peculiar.
If you mean the root cause of the submission fees circus, I’m all ears.
Ah, no. I meant Hamas/Israel
On his website he boasts attracting tens of thousands of subscribers annually, to several online magazines, and not having subscriptions amounting to tens of thousands of dollars. I wonder if there is a way to check the company's financials.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS BECKY. YOUVE DONE A GREAT SERVICE. AS WE SAY IN BROOKLYN, THE LOWER EAST SIDE, KIEV, AND MANY PLACES, "YOU'RE A MENSCH!"
I AM JEWISH, HAVE MANY RELATIVES SLAUGHTERED IN THE HOLOCAUST AND MANY. STORLES AS WELL OF MY FIRST HAND EXPERIENCES WITH ANTI SEMITISM, AND AS I GREW OLDER AND HAVE ARAB FRIENDS-PALESTINIANS, TURKISH KURDS,AND OTHERS I HAVE LEARNED ABOUT THIS COUNTRY'S HATREDS TOWARDS THE ARAB WORLD, NOT TO MENTION THE UNITED STATES' INCESSANT AND OFTEN LETHAL HATRED OF ASIANS AS SO BRILLIANTLY EXPLORED IN TRUONG TRAN'S MONUMENTAL POETRY BOOK LAST YEAR: THE BOOK OF THE OTHER. TWO VERY POWERFUL BOOKS TO BETTER UNDERSTAND PALESTINE ARE MICHAEL PALUMBO'S THE PALESTINIIAN CATASTROPHE, AND THE THOROUGH ANTHOLOGY- MODERN PALESTINIAN LITERATURE BY SALMA JAYYUSI, OVER FIVE HUNDRED PAGES OF FICTION,,POETRY, DRAMA, AND BIOGRAPHY. YOU COULD ADD A BOOK OFSTORIES BY
GHASSAN KANAFANI- PALESTINE'S CHILDREN, AND THE TRANSCENDENT POETRY OF MAHMOUD DARWISH ONE OF THE TOWERING POETS OF THE 20 AND 21 CENTURY IN SUCH BOOKS AS THE BUTTERFLY'S BURDEN,
TWO EXTREMELY VITAL AND IMPORTANT BOOKS ABOUT ANTISEMITISM WOULD BE MY BROTHERS BLOOD (ALSO TITLED AS AND THANE ROSENBAUM'S SHORT STORY COLLECTION ELIJAH VISIBLE. I HAVE A LONGER LIST FOR BOTH AREAS; CONTACT ME AT ERBRILL69@GMAIL.COM). SHALOM.
Sure, particular word: Jew-hatred. Hatred of Jews. There are general words, and particular words. We can generate them as we need them, edit them as we gain a greater understanding of history and dynamics. We are poets, writers. Develop words and meanings is what we do.
What the duck is going on, indeed.
I do not appreciate being sent a document of insinuation and mealy-mouthed exhortations to 'reconsider choices' regarding journals and organisations with significantly more intellectual heft and moral authority than the source of the document: the unremarkable 'Practising Writing' blog.
I had enjoyed Lit Mag News for some years, but I'm not willing to put up slime and smear, especially on this issue. Unsubscribing.
Thanks for bringing that to my attention. And happy workouts!
RE: conflicting information on Finishing Line Press.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Kendall Dunkelberg wrote: "The deal breaker? Finishing Line said they do NOT pay royalties. I should qualify this. They say they won’t pay royalites unless pre-sales reach 500 copies. Only then, would you be considered for a royalty contract. Prior to this, your “payment” is in copies. Prepublication sales are the only factor in this. For the book to go to press, the author must pre-sell at least 75 copies. For 75-104 copies, the press run is 300 copies and the author receives 30 as payment. ...."
Kendall Dunkelberg wrote: "The other thing on the website that could be a tip-off is that there’s NO mention of a book DISTRIBUTOR, and they appear to be primarily focused on selling books online.
Book distribution is important to me, .... "
Source: https://kendalldunkelberg.com/2019/03/27/why-i-bailed-on-a-book-deal/
Date: March 27, 2019
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Mark Danowsky wrote, quoting from a FLP author agreement: "All FLP books have a preorder sales/prepublication period in which the royalty scale is determined. This is the only way we have successfully been able to publish chapbooks. Your official prepublication/preorder period will last 9 weeks and will be determined by your editor. We determine your royalty payment by the success, or lack thereof, of the advance sales. Below you will find our preorder sales goals." ........
Mark Danowsky wrote, quoting from a FLP author agreement: "Please note: You are never required to buy copies of your book! ...."
Source: https://markdanowsky.substack.com/p/is-finishing-line-press-an-mlm
Date: November 14, 2023
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Experiences that have been shared with me are in line with Kendall's.
Pre-orders are not optional - - - but mandatory at FLP.
And how well does FLP market the books on their own?
"Marketing" is the dirty word that's never mentioned on these forums, the s.b.d. B.O. of the literary world. But the truly filthy term must be "sales figures" - - - never ever brought up in polite conversation lest it result in a spontaneous attack of diarrhea (I suppose).
Anyway, has anyone dealt with FLP recently? Are they as bad as in Kendall described in 2019? Have they reformed?
Genuinely interested in learning more about FLP from poets who have submitted there. Thanks.
This is not meant to be a comment for Linda but I am adding here since there is discussion about FLP. Please be careful what you write, everyone. There are a lot of us who have been published by FLP and we don't need to be damaged by incorrect info. FLP uses Ingram for distribution. Yes, you have to sell a certain (non-onerous) amount of books to qualify for Ingram. I have liked the pre-order method (for a book or two) because you have immediate readers for reviews, etc. That said, too many preorders might wear out your mailing list! I've been happy with them and love their covers. I have also been published by Kelsay and Alien Buddha Press (good experience with both). Since FLP publishes a lot of poets, without them a lot of books would go unpublished because most other publishers publish very few poetry books.
Thank you, Luanne. Yes, Ingram is our distributor. FLP is also a proud member of CLMP. CLMP does not permit MLMs to be members.
Thank you, Luanne, for sticking to the topic - experiences with Finishing Line Press.
I hope FLP markets better than Alien Buddha Press. I doubt ABP uses Ingram for distribution. I paid to have an ARC created, which ABP won't do; I also paid to put my book on NetGalley.
My ARC is there for 3 more days: https://www.netgalley.com/catalog/book/306425
I think it's on us these days to do most of our own marketing. ABP has put together a couple of small things, and now Kelsay is hosting readings, which is really nice. They weren't doing that when my book came out. I'd love to see a list of small poetry presses that really help market and publish more than three books a year.
Thank you very much, Luanne. Glad to see we're finally discussing this important topic!!!!!
I've raised the issue a few times - - marketing tactics and sales numbers - - but * * crickets * *
This reminds me of a kids' dance school that requires parents to buy tickets and costumes for the performances, or the way young opera singers are treated by festivals: pay to play. The performances are earnest and can have many layers of artist value, but it's still pay to play. Partly a side product of how arts are devalued in our (US) society and not well-supported by the government.
Women friends of mine used to sing with Freshmen Chorus and one other choral group. They were required to sell 20 tix to each performance or get dumped.
One woman's mother, who owned a fleet of taxicabs, used to buy up her daughter's tix and give them away to her drivers as a perk, then use this expense as a tax deduction.
It's probably no easier to sell 20 tix to Freshmen Chorus than it is to sell your latest book if your circle of friends is very small.
Actually, FLP does pay royalties to our authors. When I first took over the press in 2000, we paid in copies. It was just me operating the press. I didn’t have a staff to help facilitate in these matters. I paid the authors 10% of their limited pressrun: a 250 pressrun would be 25 copies. I made each book by hand. I loved it. As FLP grew, we saw the need to pay in royalty payments instead of copies. We no longer pay in copies nor do we produce limited pressruns. Also, the sales goal was 55 copies. If an author fails to sell 55 copies, we publish the book anyway and offer a smaller royalty rate. If the book has sales close to 55 copies I usually buy the needed copies to make sure the author has a good royalty rate (or back in the day, a good pressrun.) We have rarely cancelled a book. At no time ever have we had a 500 copy sales goal. I published poetry as an act of love. It makes me cry to think people assume I’ve done this as some kind of con. Also, attacking FLP is attacking any poet I have published. I only select the best manuscripts for publication and for people to say we are an MLM devalues the books of the poets we have published. My goal was always to provide a voice for the underrepresented poets of my day: women, LBGTQ+, people of color, among others. As a mixed-race LatinX woman, I know what it’s like to be passed over. I wanted to make sure people like me were represented.
Thank you for clarifying, Leah.
I've published two chapbooks with FLP, and it's been a very positive experience. For the first one, in 2020, I was paid in copies; the presales determined the size of the print run. For the second one, in 2022, the model had changed such that the presales determined the rate of royalties (and yes, I have received royalties). FLP promotes books through social media, and they encourage authors to use their own social media and other means. I don't think this is unusual. They distribute through Ingram, and the books are also available through Amazon as well as on FLP's own website.
Thank you for this FLP update.
Does FLP do any REAL marketing? EX: do they put the book on NetGalley? EX: do they expose the book during the pre-order interval via a book sales funnel? EX: do they advertise?
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* * * FUNNEL: When my chapbook "Messengers of the Macabre: Hallowe'en Poems" went thru a book sales funnel 3X (pre-release), it sold 150+ copies. Funnel success depends on the strength and size of the author's mailing list.
* * * NetGalley: My current chapbook "Vampire Ventures" is on NetGalley; this does not affect sales per se - - but it builds book buzz via reviews and exposure to the marketplace.
https://www.netgalley.com/catalog/book/306425
do you take your profits on your book to the blood bank?
Only if there's someone who is my TYPE, Ernie.
www.VampireVenturesPoems.com